Frustrating progress for the upper body!! Me MAD!

[confuzzl3don3]

Today i finally hit 91kg (200lb) 3 x 5 squats :D

But the thing that gets me down is the lack of progress in my upper body lifts (press and bench). No matter how hard i try and everything i just can't get them up. Went for 58kg on the bench press today and only managed 5/4/4. And as you know my press is screwing up at like 37kg. Why can't i make progress on these lifts?!!? :mad:

As far as eating goes, i'm gaining weight so that's gotta be good. Just weighed in today it 70kg, so i've gained like 1-1.5kg over the past week. And sleepwise i'm getting enough (8hours). I just dunno why and it's really annoying the crap out of me.

To top that off, i couldn't get 115kg deadlift today (failed to break off ground after 2-3 tries). If you fail to even get 1 rep, what should u do?? Usually i try to just drop the weight by 10% and do that for 5 reps, but it's really strange that even if i do that, the weight feels insanely hard as compared to when i did that weight like a 3-4 workouts ago.

ARGHH!!! I just want to get my bench and press up, my upper body is a joke!!

[tescott]

Just keep eating as much as you can, and be patient. In terms of a failed lift, just try it again next time.

Exactly how much are you eating? Are you drinking a 3L bottle of milk every day? Bacon, sausages and eggs every morning? And two other big, fatty meals for lunch and dinner? I assume you're on uni holidays now, so you should have time to eat...

[confuzzl3don3]

I'll give a run down on what i eat daily:
Brekkie:
2 glasses of milk
3 eggs with a cup of oatmeal
can of tuna (about 110-120g) with about 200g of boiled mixed vegies
2 pieces of fruit

Morning tea
glass of milk
piece of fruit
hanful of mixed nuts
fish oil tablet
1 weetbix

If i have a workout, instead of a morning tea i'll have a post workout meal:
2 glasses of milk with 1 scoop of ON 100% whey
banana
1 weetbix
fish oil tablet

Lunch
2 sandwiches (4 slices of bread) with lettuce, carrot, cucumber, beans, and chicken (about 200+g)
glass of milk

Arvo tea
glass of milk
1 weetbix
piece of fruit
handful of nuts

Dinner
basically what my mum cooks - bowl of rice usually and then vegies and meat and stuff

Before bed meal
glass of milk
100ish grams of cottage cheese
table spoon of PB (around 20 or so grams)
piece of fruit

And that's basically my meals for the day.

On an additional note, if i miss that rep, like for the deadlift today. Since i have a powerrack at home, should i try again later on in the day? Or should i just leave it until next time's workout like i usually do?

[Paul Sousa]

I'm wondering if it's form related. Are you gripping the crap out of the bar? Keeping everything tight?

[confuzzl3don3]

Yeah trying to do. I've posted the form a few times for my press and benches. Well all my lifts really.

[stronger]

Are you doing starting strength?

[Paul Sousa]

Just watched your press video with 35kg. First thing I noticed was your wrists. Do not let them bend. Keep your wrists straight and squeeze the bar as hard as you can to create tension in your arms. You may also want to widen your grip just a bit (try it during warm-ups and see how it feels),

[Nauticus]

How long are you resting in between sets? I need to rest for at least 7 minutes between each in order to do 5 full reps.

[misspelledgeoff]

confuzled, you are not eating enough and that's why you are stalling.

everywhere you see weetbix (wtf?)in your diet log, insert a BK Stacker or equivalent. then you'll be getting closer.

[tmatt]

confuzzl3don3, how much do you weigh and how much weight are you gaining a week? You look like you're eating pretty clean, you may need some more calories.

I looked at some of your old benching videos and you look pretty flat on the bench. Get your arch and get your shoulders back. Also, where are your feet? Try to get a video that shows your foot position, that may help us work out the issue.

For both the bench and the press, you should be feeling a groove. I don't know how to explain it, only that when you get it right, you will feel it. If the weight is moving all over the place and you're struggling to keep a vertical path, you're not in that groove and you won't lift as much. Find that groove with a good arch in the bench and getting your press form straightened out.

[Platus]

I looked at the 35kg video - your form looks fine (though, sometimes you pause a bit too long at the top or the bottom of the lift).

Sorry if this has already been asked, but are you microloading your pressing movements? Even if you add only .5kg to your press every workout, it will add up to a significant increase over a couple of months.

[confuzzl3don3]

Thanks every1 for the helpful advice. I was adding 0.5kg every workout, but when i upped my calories i found myself getting stronger and so i started back to increasing weights by 1kg each time and i could still get 3 x 5 so i kept going at 1kg/workout. You suggesting i drop back to 0.5kg again.

And about how much i weigh, it's 70kg (154lbs) and i just gained like 1-1.5kg from last week so i thought that was pretty decent.

I'll try and get some new vids up from my next workout and rewatch the DVD and reread the book to try and make sure i'm doing everything right.

PS. I was still wondering, since i failed even to break my deadlift at 115kg from the floor, should i just forgot about it until next workout, or try again in a while from now?

[Nauticus]

Thanks every1 for the helpful advice. I was adding 0.5kg every workout, but when i upped my calories i found myself getting stronger and so i started back to increasing weights by 1kg each time and i could still get 3 x 5 so i kept going at 1kg/workout. You suggesting i drop back to 0.5kg again.

And about how much i weigh, it's 70kg (154lbs) and i just gained like 1-1.5kg from last week so i thought that was pretty decent.

I'll try and get some new vids up from my next workout and rewatch the DVD and reread the book to try and make sure i'm doing everything right.

PS. I was still wondering, since i failed even to break my deadlift at 115kg from the floor, should i just forgot about it until next workout, or try again in a while from now?

If you failed to break it from the floor, then you would probably have terrible form even if it were liftable - just lower the weight and go from there.

And rest more between sets if you already don't for 7+ mins.

[Paul Sousa]

As for your weight gain, at 154 lbs. you should be gaining more than a couple pounds in a week if you are eating enough. I was 188 lbs. in October and have been eating at least 5000 cals per day since and weighed in at 213 lbs. this morning. Steak, milk, egg nog, peanut butter should all be in your diet.

[confuzzl3don3]

Wow 7+ minutes. I usually go for breaks between 3-5 minutes. I find if i go for too long breaks i seem to let myself relax and all, and then i can't get that tight intra-abdominal pressure and all that, that is so important.

And so your advice is probably just to forget about the workout and just try again next time, and not to try and give it another shot again today?

[knox]

Just watched your press video with 35kg. First thing I noticed was your wrists. Do not let them bend. Keep your wrists straight and squeeze the bar as hard as you can to create tension in your arms. You may also want to widen your grip just a bit (try it during warm-ups and see how it feels),

Paul, do you mind clarifying exactly how this is done? In a post a while back Ripp stated that for the 3rd edition of SS he will be changing the chapter on the press to say that the wrists should be straight instead of bent, similar to the bench press, because this allows for more efficient transfer of power. The problem with this is that I can't rest the bar anywhere at the bottom of the lift. Having bent wrists at the bottom allows me to rest the bar on my chest just below the clavicle in between each rep, whereas with straight wrists at the bottom I'm holding the bar in mid air in front of my chin. Is this correct? I don't mean to hijack Confuzzled's thread, but maybe this advice will apply to him as well?

[confuzzl3don3]

Definitely. I've always wondered that too. To rest the bar at the bottom of the rep, you see how my wrists are bent and elbows are heaps in front. But as i go to lift, my elbows pul back to being only right in front, but i can't seem to line them up to just be slightly in front of the bar at the start to have them rest nicely on the anterior delts.

[Paul Sousa]

Paul, do you mind clarifying exactly how this is done? In a post a while back Ripp stated that for the 3rd edition of SS he will be changing the chapter on the press to say that the wrists should be straight instead of bent, similar to the bench press, because this allows for more efficient transfer of power. The problem with this is that I can't rest the bar anywhere at the bottom of the lift. Having bent wrists at the bottom allows me to rest the bar on my chest just below the clavicle in between each rep, whereas with straight wrists at the bottom I'm holding the bar in mid air in front of my chin. Is this correct? I don't mean to hijack Confuzzled's thread, but maybe this advice will apply to him as well?

Honestly I don't have a great cue or anything. The best thing I can say is to just squeeze the bar tight. I assume once you relax your grip you can't hold your wrists straight, and the relaxed grip will also mean you don't have tension in your arms which will kill your press. Think of it as your midsection in the squat, if you don't hold everything tight you won't move bigger weights since you lose power from the floor to the bar. Same thing with your arms in the press, and the best way to ensure that tension is to grip the hell out of the bar.

Edit - also, the bottom of the press was why I suggested widening your grip a bit. You can get the bar closer to you in the bottom that way. Not sure if Rip would agree with any of this, but it's worked pretty well for me in my limited training with the press.

[stronger]

Wow 7+ minutes. I usually go for breaks between 3-5 minutes. I find if i go for too long breaks i seem to let myself relax and all, and then i can't get that tight intra-abdominal pressure and all that, that is so important.

And so your advice is probably just to forget about the workout and just try again next time, and not to try and give it another shot again today?

Rest longer, eat tons and don't try and go up a full kg per workout. The press has to be coaxed to get stronger. Any progress is good progress

[confuzzl3don3]

Ok thanks guys. I'll err for a lower weight increase on the press and bench. I guess i just wanted my upper body lifts to "catch up" to where my lower lifts were at least progressing

[tescott]

Personally, rest time doesn't sound like it'll be a big factor - the weights your moving just aren't really heavy enough. 5 min should be plenty. And you should be able to be adding at least 1kg per workout. The program necessarily involves this, especially early in the game.

What you do need is HEAPS more FAT in your diet. You need it for recovery, and it's calorie dense. Mix olive oil and/or mayonnaise into your tuna, and pour oil all over your vegies, or fry them in oil instead of boiling them. Cook your eggs in plenty of butter. Have some bacon with your eggs. Replace the weetbix with something fatty, like weetbix with lots of peanut butter smeared all over them. Fry the chicken in your sandwich, add cheese, bacon, and mayo, and lots of butter on the bread.

To get this down, you may need to reduce carbs. That's ok, because if you eat the same quantity, you'll get more calories from fat.

Also, your 7 glasses of milk probably adds to 2L. Just get the 3L bottles, and get through one each day.

[confuzzl3don3]

Hmm, is there a particular reason for fats > carbs? Either than being more calorie dense, if one theoretically ate the same amount of cals from carbs and fats would there be a difference in recovery? Does fats somehow improve recovery?

[nisora33]

confuzzled

Just took a look at the last press video you posted. Several things that I noted:

Your wrists are fine. You WILL NOT have a perfectly neutral wrist when pressing or benching. A slight inclination backward is fine so long long as the bar is resting in the meat of the palms. Someone show me a heavy set of either the bench or press where the wrists were perfectly straight. The reason is because when the wrists are kept like that, the bar will try to slip forward out of the hands.

You're not keeping your elbows in front of the bar at the bottom of your reps: as a result, I don't think you're pressing as close to your face as you could be.

Second, the bottom-most portion of each rep is very loose. You've got to stay tight as you're going back down to the start.

Third, and most definitely related to the second point, your abs - and likely your quads and hips - are not squeezed tightly enough. Even when you're just standing there holding the weight prior to doing the first rep, I can see the barbell swaying and drifting about. You've got to be 100 % damned tight from the start. Then you've got to stay tight through out. Just before you begin that first rep, take a moment and squeeze the knees, hips, butt and abs as hard as you can. The chest should already have been squeezed up into the bar from the moment you scooped under the bar to take it out of the rack.

Lastly, it's not necessary to touch as low on your chest as you are on some of the reps. Touching the top of the delts is sufficient. In fact, the lower you make contact on the chest, the further the distance between the bar and the scapula becomes. Touching lower than the top of the delts is not necessary nor is it recommended.

In addition to gaining some weight, you've got to hammer these form problems.

-Stacey

[confuzzl3don3]

Thank you stacey. I was just rewatching the SS DVD and found that as you said i was going too low on each rep and also at the start, i was starting with the bar too high up (under my neck) when it should be lower more like under the clavicle? (that's the impression i got from looking at the press section on the DVD).

Just got 1 more question about press form. At the start when you should have a little bit of backward lean before you start the rep, should this lean be facilitated at the hip so the whole torso leans back, or rather just the upper back. I found that when i lean back it was mainly my middle back arching back rather than at the hips. Which is right?

[titan]

Confuz,

I don't want to harp on and sound like a real cunt, but I think you have a problem understanding plain and simple instructions... I posted in your previous threads here (http://startingstrength.com/resources/forum/showpost.php?p=79911&postcount=18) and here (http://startingstrength.com/resources/forum/showpost.php?p=79916&postcount=20).

I will make it as clear as possible for you.

YOU AREN'T EATING ENOUGH!

Gaining 1-1.5kg in a week is fuck all when you weight 70kgs, I could gain 1kg eating a big fucking steak and a bowl of rice and vegies.

Take it from one skinny cunt to another, I was stalling at ridiculously small weights on the press when I was eating like a bird as well, as soon as I started eating properly I wasn't struggling with measley little weights.

Whoever told you about eating just above maintenance like you posted in another thread is wrong, you need to put your precious fat calipers and scales away for 3-4 months and consume around 4-5k* of food per day and if you are truly doing the SS program you will grow like never before and won't hit a plateau of less than 40kgs.

Your squat will reach 1.5x bodyweight, your DL will reach 2x bodyweight and your other lifts (bench, press) will take care of themselves.

* this is a bare minimum, try 4-5k per day and see how you go, if you are still struggling you may need to up it even further to 6-8k per day.

[nisora33]

confuzzled

Conceptualize it this way:

Don't think of it as the back arching, think of it as the abs STRETCHING under tension. The same way there is a bounce to your squat, which comes from the hams and glutes being stretched while maintaining tension and then snapping back, there is a bounce, or stretch reflex, that originates in the abs. The abs stay contracted but are nevertheless stretched when the load comes down to your shoulders. When the abs return to their unstretched condition, stored energy is released as a rebound force that then travels up to the bar. When executed correctly, this stretch happens all throughout the abs - not one section of them -but there should be NO UNDUE STRESS FELT IN THE SPINE WHATSOEVER.

[nisora33]

Confuz,

I don't want to harp on and sound like a real cunt, but I think you have a problem understanding plain and simple instructions... I posted in your previous threads here (http://startingstrength.com/resources/forum/showpost.php?p=79911&postcount=18) and here (http://startingstrength.com/resources/forum/showpost.php?p=79916&postcount=20).

I will make it as clear as possible for you.

YOU AREN'T EATING ENOUGH!

Gaining 1-1.5kg in a week is fuck all when you weight 70kgs, I could gain 1kg eating a big fucking steak and a bowl of rice and vegies.

Take it from one skinny cunt to another, I was stalling at ridiculously small weights on the press when I was eating like a bird as well, as soon as I started eating properly I wasn't struggling with measley little weights.

Whoever told you about eating just above maintenance like you posted in another thread is wrong, you need to put your precious fat calipers and scales away for 3-4 months and consume around 4-5k* of food per day and if you are truly doing the SS program you will grow like never before and won't hit a plateau of less than 40kgs.

Your squat will reach 1.5x bodyweight, your DL will reach 2x bodyweight and your other lifts (bench, press) will take care of themselves.

* this is a bare minimum, try 4-5k per day and see how you go, if you are still struggling you may need to up it even further to 6-8k per day.

What he said.

[tescott]

Just bite the bullet dude. Eat. Lots. Of calorie dense food.

[BryanM]

Fat has been an essential nutrient to mammals for a billion zillion years.

Aim for 10 pounds a week. 10. Not 2.

[Sgsolberg]

Confuzed: Let's try something simple. How big do you want to be? How much do you want to lift? How important is this for you?

If you want to grow, consider how active you are in the rest of your life combined with the fact that you obviously have a great metabolism. This indicates that you will need to eat more than you think. One tool I find helpful is fitday.com. It takes very little time to track what you eat, and it tells you how much you've eaten, and the macronutrient breakdowns for that. For a 90kg mini-man, a good day of eating will be around 4-5k calories. Start with a big jump in the calories (the afore mentioned numbers) and up them every time your progress starts stalling.

As for why you need fat, it's because it's calorie laden. Simple Carbohydrates are fast energy. They are needed to fuel our workouts and directly afterwards to keep from passing out. Protein helps build muscle, and you want that. Fat gives you the easiest way to get more energy for your living. One idea is that most of the day you need to eat lots of protein and fat, consuming enough veggies so that you keep regular. Then have a good protein and carbohydrate meal after working out.

[knox]

Confuzzled, do some reading. Seriously. Google, Wikipedia and the search function on this site are your friends. Here's some 10th grade biology for you:

Carbohydrates are used as an immediate source of energy. That's it. They are more efficient at providing energy than either protein or fat, and consequently, you should eat a lot of carbs just before and just after your workout (to fuel your workout and to replenish glycogen stores in your muscles afterwards). It's important to note that carbs are not a macronutrient - i.e. YOU CAN LIVE WITHOUT CARBS. It wouldn't be ideal to do so, of course, but you could.

Lipids (fats) ARE a macronutrient, and have a wide range of uses in your body. Lipids:

- Are the main structural component of EVERY BIOLOGICAL MEMBRANE OF EVERY CELL IN YOUR BODY
- Are an essential part of the production of testosterone
- Allow for the storage of essential vitamins A, D, E and K, which are lipid-soluble
- Provide energy. A higher percentage of the energy you burn comes from fat when you perform low-energy activities, like sleeping, sitting, standing, walking - i.e. the majority of your average person's day.

Okay?

[confuzzl3don3]

Thanks all for the replies. I was just wondering now whether i am doing too much to allow recovery to occur properly. Currently i'm doing:
Workout A
Squats
Bench press
Deadlift
Chin ups/pull ups
Abs

Workout B
Squats
Press
Power clean
Pull ups/chin ups
Abs

Used to not do any chins or pulls, and maybe because the weight was lighter i could get away with shorter rest times. But as the weight is getting heavier (for me), i have to rest longer but to follow my workout program, i end up spending close to 2 hrs and like today my arms were aching from doing power cleans (yes it probably means i was pulling too much with my arms) but didn't even have much energy to do the chins after. I just really want my upper body to get stronger and so i wanted to keep up the chins/pulls to do that, but is this too much for my body and being of detriment rather than help? Should i like break up my workout so i do abs and chins/pulls later that day or something so i break it into like a 1 and half hr workout and another half hr workout later?

[stronger]

Thanks all for the replies. I was just wondering now whether i am doing too much to allow recovery to occur properly. Currently i'm doing:
Workout A
Squats
Bench press
Deadlift
Chin ups/pull ups
Abs

Workout B
Squats
Press
Power clean
Pull ups/chin ups
Abs

Used to not do any chins or pulls, and maybe because the weight was lighter i could get away with shorter rest times. But as the weight is getting heavier (for me), i have to rest longer but to follow my workout program, i end up spending close to 2 hrs and like today my arms were aching from doing power cleans (yes it probably means i was pulling too much with my arms) but didn't even have much energy to do the chins after. I just really want my upper body to get stronger and so i wanted to keep up the chins/pulls to do that, but is this too much for my body and being of detriment rather than help? Should i like break up my workout so i do abs and chins/pulls later that day or something so i break it into like a 1 and half hr workout and another half hr workout later?

If you want to break it up, and have the time to do so, go for it. PP mentions this if I recall correctly

[titan]

Thanks all for the replies. I was just wondering now whether i am doing too much to allow recovery to occur properly. Currently i'm doing:
Workout A
Squats
Bench press
Deadlift
Chin ups/pull ups
Abs

Workout B
Squats
Press
Power clean
Pull ups/chin ups
Abs

Used to not do any chins or pulls, and maybe because the weight was lighter i could get away with shorter rest times. But as the weight is getting heavier (for me), i have to rest longer but to follow my workout program, i end up spending close to 2 hrs and like today my arms were aching from doing power cleans (yes it probably means i was pulling too much with my arms) but didn't even have much energy to do the chins after. I just really want my upper body to get stronger and so i wanted to keep up the chins/pulls to do that, but is this too much for my body and being of detriment rather than help? Should i like break up my workout so i do abs and chins/pulls later that day or something so i break it into like a 1 and half hr workout and another half hr workout later?

Are you even doing SS? It doesn't appear that you are...

Why would you want to do chins/pull ups every workout? Throw that together with bench/dead (A) and press/power cleans (B) and you are doing way too much. You should be doing pull ups and chins on a max of two workouts each week, and preferably on Mon/Fri to give yourself additional recovery time.

But again, this isn't the SS program so your results will vary and I'm not surprised your recovery is up shit creek.

[confuzzl3don3]

So you saying i should drop the pull ups and chins altogether? And do it like the PP novice program with only squats, bench, dead, and then squats, press, cleans? The things is i thought that chins/pull ups could help get my upper body stronger

[tescott]

I successfully used a routine like yours for a while, though only chinned after deadlifts, not after PCs. Try that. Oh, and I didn't bother with abs, and either should you. Read Rip's latest article.

This is what I did:

A
Squat
Bench
Dead
Chin/Pull

B
Squat
Press
Power Clean

(Now, I work it so I PC, Dead and Pull/Chin once a week each)

Given your numbers, and your bodyweight, you should have no trouble recovering from this, IF YOU EAT ENOUGH, INCLUDING A LOT OF FAT.



In sum, in danger of repeating ourselves, you need to EAT. How's that going anyway? Lots of fat?

[confuzzl3don3]

Yep. Just spread an avocado over my sandwich for lunch. Delicious :D

[tescott]

Butter?

If you haven't already, go to the food FAQ on 70sbig.com

http://70sbig.com/?page_id=7

[titan]

Yep. Just spread an avocado over my sandwich for lunch. Delicious :D
Avocado? Man, ditch that shit, unless you are eating 10 of them at once in some kind of gucamole with a big bag of corn chips....

You should be spreading very large amounts of peanut butter on your sandwiches and that should be a mid-morning snack or afternoon snack, not lunch!

[BryanM]

Chin ups and pull ups use the same muscles as the bench and press, just in a different way. If you do like 3 worksets of the press and pull ups on the same day, the quality of whatever comes second will suffer.

And what is this "abs" thing? The deadlift is the torso exercise, with squats and power cleans supporting it.

You can save precious calories by not doing these things, and as a bonus, you'll have more time to eat. More is not always better.

[Kane]

I agree with the above posts. You're doing too much. Eat more, drop the chins and ab work. You might even want to consider taking your two day rest more often, either scheduled or when just when you feel like you need it. I had a really tough time gaining weight when I first started out a few years ago. I just kept on bumping up the amount of food I ate and decreasing the amount of training until I found what worked and then went from 170 lbs to 215 lbs in 3 months (I'm 6'3"). I'd normally train 3 days one week and two days the next. Being so stressed out about not progressing with your lifts and trying to gain weight might not be helping either. Be patient.

[tescott]

How's the progress, Confuzz?

[confuzzl3don3]

Was weekends so haven't hit the iron yet. Going in a while. Hopefully some new PRs :D

[Paul Sousa]

Hey confuzzl3don3, I know others have said to not worry about it, but I still think your wrist angle could be an issue in your press. I pressed today and tried to actually pay attention to what I do to try and describe it better for you. At the bottom of my press my wrists do bend back slightly (in order to keep the bar closer to me), but as I press the bar I straighten my wrists by the time my hands are over my head my wrists are basically straight. Give it a shot during a warmup and see if it helps at all, could do nothing but it could help.

[nisora33]

Hey confuzzl3don3, I know others have said to not worry about it, but I still think your wrist angle could be an issue in your press. I pressed today and tried to actually pay attention to what I do to try and describe it better for you. At the bottom of my press my wrists do bend back slightly (in order to keep the bar closer to me), but as I press the bar I straighten my wrists by the time my hands are over my head my wrists are basically straight. Give it a shot during a warmup and see if it helps at all, could do nothing but it could help.

See this:

http://www.startingstrength.com/resources/forum/showpost.php?p=82070&postcount=10

You WILL NOT have a perfectly straight wrist. Confuzzled can tighten up a little bit by squeezing the bar harder and that will help but straightening more will not help him, as Mr. Lascek has now confirmed.

[confuzzl3don3]

Thanks guys for that. I'll try that on wednesday when i hit the press. And i stalled on my deadlift again today. Once again couldn't break 115kg off the ground. What gives....it just seems to me that my 5RM is my 1RM because i have never been able to do like 2 or 3 reps or something. It's either i hit or 5 or i can't break it off the ground...I dropped off 10% to 105kg which i could do but damn it's pissing me off. Time for another deload? I've already had one previously at 102.5kg failing to get 105kg for 5 reps and now ive been stuck for 2 workouts in a row trying to get 115kg. Squats were freaking killing me but i managed to get 92.5kg. Bench actually made 58kg. Dam i never would have thought that having an extra 1-2 min rest would make such a big difference. Usually i have 3-4 minute rest between the bench sets. Went 4-5 minutes this time and i could actually hit 3 x 5 at 58kg even though it was hard. Anyways a bit peeved now though because i think i strained my back helping my mum lift some groceries from the car. Must have put it in an awkward position and then strained it when trying to grab the box of milk cartons. Argh now my left lat is killing me when i raise my abduct my arm. Hopefully it's just a little thing and will heal up in a few hours.

[pbjorge12]

Thanks guys for that. I'll try that on wednesday when i hit the press. And i stalled on my deadlift again today. Once again couldn't break 115kg off the ground. What gives....it just seems to me that my 5RM is my 1RM because i have never been able to do like 2 or 3 reps or something. It's either i hit or 5 or i can't break it off the ground...I dropped off 10% to 105kg which i could do but damn it's pissing me off. Time for another deload? I've already had one previously at 102.5kg failing to get 105kg for 5 reps and now ive been stuck for 2 workouts in a row trying to get 115kg. Squats were freaking killing me but i managed to get 92.5kg. Bench actually made 58kg. Dam i never would have thought that having an extra 1-2 min rest would make such a big difference. Usually i have 3-4 minute rest between the bench sets. Went 4-5 minutes this time and i could actually hit 3 x 5 at 58kg even though it was hard. Anyways a bit peeved now though because i think i strained my back helping my mum lift some groceries from the car. Must have put it in an awkward position and then strained it when trying to grab the box of milk cartons. Argh now my left lat is killing me when i raise my abduct my arm. Hopefully it's just a little thing and will heal up in a few hours.

How hard are you training your deadlift (everything in general really)?

It's a lesson that has taken me quite a while to learn, but their is a difference between training hard and training hard as fuck. Training hard gets results but their mediocre and slow to get. Training hard as fuck is infinitely more intense but it just plain works better.

I feel that it might be worth including something discussing training intensity in Starting Strength v3 - Especially since so many reading it are new to the barbell game and are unaware of how hard one must train.

Justin's article was enlightening for me and might be for you.
http://70sbig.com/content/do_hard_things.pdf

This is my experience as a novice at least...

[tescott]

You didn't really answer my question, which was more on the progress of your eating. How's THAT going?

[Paul Sousa]

See this:

http://www.startingstrength.com/resources/forum/showpost.php?p=82070&postcount=10

You WILL NOT have a perfectly straight wrist. Confuzzled can tighten up a little bit by squeezing the bar harder and that will help but straightening more will not help him, as Mr. Lascek has now confirmed.

That post actually confirms what I am talking about. To me Confuzzled's wrists look like the third picture Justin posted. By straight wrists I mean the second picture. To me the first picture isn't actually straight, there is some flexion involved. Justin's second pic is how my wrists are at the bottom and they straighten just little bit more as I approach full extension. It's a small, nuanced difference, but it could help him out. I am by no means trying to get him to have his wrists like the first picture.

[nisora33]

Paul, dude, it's not that bad:

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2646/4147584137_e82d24edbb_o.jpg

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2564/4147592941_fa4fd22e9d_o.jpg

[Paul Sousa]

Deleted to stop going back and forth on grip.

[nisora33]

Deleted to stop going back and forth on grip.

I'm just being an ass now anyway.