The Olympic-Style Press - Bill Starr

[stef]

"[I]n the early sixties, Tony Garcy, America’s premier 165-pounder devised a new and different way to press. It required more than raw strength. It required a high degree of timing, coordination, balance, and quickness...the Olympic-style press is really a quick lift. You are, in effect, hurling the bar upward off your shoulders in one smooth, coordinated movement."

Full article (http://startingstrength.com/articles/olympic_press_starr.pdf)

Resources page (http://startingstrength.com/index.php/site/resources/)

[tallison]

Hey, Thanks! I've definitely improved my appreciation for this exercise and can't wait to give it a try exactly as described.

One small critique -- the sketch is good in terms of communicating how the form progresses, but the hands look odd -- When I first glanced at it, I thought "An underhand grip?!". When I didn't see that anywhere in the text and thought about just how silly it would be, I studied the picture harder and realized that it's just not visually clear in which direction the bar is being gripped -- there's no partial line showing which side of the bar the thumb is on -- but I realized that it could just as easily be overhand as underhand -- and I'm fairly confident, from every other bit of common sense I can muster, that it is in fact the normal overhand grip that is intended. I just thought I'd point it out, cause I know I'm going to see somebody in the gym, trying to do it the other way, based on how they think it's illustrated, here....

Thanks, again, for the article. This site is amazing for the collection of really high quality information on a subject where that can be in very low supply!

Best,
Tom

[Dastardly]

Great article.

I was wondering if applying this technique is relevant for novices moving small weights?

I have been stalled on my press for a very long time and have been considering the use of push presses to break the plateau. But would use of this dynamic olympic press be better?

[Guido]

Great article.

I was wondering if applying this technique is relevant for novices moving small weights?

I have been stalled on my press for a very long time and have been considering the use of push presses to break the plateau. But would use of this dynamic olympic press be better?


Based on this exceprt from the article, it would seem that the earlier in the process you learn this version of the lift, the better off you are:


And others most certainly did want to join in, and as a result records in the press began to fall as the younger lifters coming onto the national scene had learned this style from the very beginning. For those who had been in the sport for some time, the transition from power pressing to adopting the more dynamic style was difficult. Old keys and habits had to be discarded and replaced with new moves.

[PVC]

Great article.

I was wondering if applying this technique is relevant for novices moving small weights?

I have been stalled on my press for a very long time and have been considering the use of push presses to break the plateau. But would use of this dynamic olympic press be better?

Come on Dastardly, seriously.

How much do you weigh, and how much are you pressing right now?

If your answers are less than 200 lbs and less than 130 lbs respectively, I think you know what to do.

[Dastardly]

Come on Dastardly, seriously.

How much do you weigh, and how much are you pressing right now?

If your answers are less than 200 lbs and less than 130 lbs respectively, I think you know what to do.

I know you think you are being helpful, but please stop being so motherfucking patronising! :rolleyes:

I am not stupid, and know very well that body mass is the main limiting factor for novice training/linear progression, and also total strength potential in general. Could you stop being a parrot already, of course I know this. I have known this for the whole time I have been training.

Growing bodymass is a fucking slow progress, what is one supposed to do during the sessions when they are stuck? Just wait to grow before they can lift a bit more?

The only options are resetting/making a change to programming or applying more beneficial technique to help break through the plateau.

In this situation the options would be either the push-press or this olympic press. Just so the damn weight can be lifted, and perhaps in a couple sessions it will be liftable with strict form/no hip or leg drive.

Obviously increases in bodyweight will have the most significant effect on lifting potential, and a trainee such as myself will still work hard with this goal. But the rate of BW increase will taper down for anyone, and in the end the strength value of this BW will too diminish. I am obviously not at this stage yet, and the next 15kg I manage to to add to my BW will probably make the biggest difference. I have managed to re-ignite the weight gain, but is going to come very slowly so I am bound to find myself stalling a lot, but most significantly in the press.

I ask a simple question about the actual topic of the olympic press and you guys always have to revert to this silly crap.

[Mark Rippetoe]

http://startingstrength.com/resources/forum/showthread.php?t=15449

[Lionheart]

Anyone happen to spot a video of this lift being performed correctly? Anywhere on youtube maybe? Real interested on seeing how it is really done. Thanks

Semper Fi,
Peter

[Squatson]

I'm pressin wheels tonight!

[Squatson]

I know you think you are being helpful, but please stop being so motherfucking patronising! :rolleyes:

I am not stupid, and know very well that body mass is the main limiting factor for novice training/linear progression, and also total strength potential in general. Could you stop being a parrot already, of course I know this. I have known this for the whole time I have been training.

Growing bodymass is a fucking slow progress, what is one supposed to do during the sessions when they are stuck? Just wait to grow before they can lift a bit more?

The only options are resetting/making a change to programming or applying more beneficial technique to help break through the plateau.

In this situation the options would be either the push-press or this olympic press. Just so the damn weight can be lifted, and perhaps in a couple sessions it will be liftable with strict form/no hip or leg drive.

Obviously increases in bodyweight will have the most significant effect on lifting potential, and a trainee such as myself will still work hard with this goal. But the rate of BW increase will taper down for anyone, and in the end the strength value of this BW will too diminish. I am obviously not at this stage yet, and the next 15kg I manage to to add to my BW will probably make the biggest difference. I have managed to re-ignite the weight gain, but is going to come very slowly so I am bound to find myself stalling a lot, but most significantly in the press.

I ask a simple question about the actual topic of the olympic press and you guys always have to revert to this silly crap.


I think what the guys have been and are trying to tell you that almost all of your questions can be answered by eating more. We also understand that you have some problems with the milk and eating a lot.

For me, eating all the calories that I need each day is actually harder than the workouts, but I see it AS PART OF THE PROGRAM.

If I can man up and squat 270 for 5 after the last two sets that almost made me cry, I sure as hell can man up and eat that 4th double cheeseburger, 8th egg, last bite of steak.

For me, growing bodymass has not been a slow process at all...I gained 8 pounds the first week, 15 at 2 weeks, and 25 total pounds the first month. My total at the start of the 5th month is around 38 pounds (206 up from 168).

I guess I am just frustrated with guys that think there is something wrong with the program, or can't figure out why they are stuck on this lift or that lift.

You guys want the cliff notes...the easy way out...just read Dostoyevsky, it might be hard to get through, but it is way more rewarding that way in the end.

[El Viejo]

I really enjoyed this article, but I think I would need to see a video (preferably slow-mo) of this style of press to really understand the technique.

I found Starr's account of how the Bench Press worked its way up to its current status very interesting. I've been around for awhile and never heard this explanation before. Also, his comments on Rotator Cuff problems being essentially a non-issue before the Bench Press became the sine qua non of exercise programs gives one something to think about. I haven't done Bench Presses in 2 years due to shoulder issues (I tried a few times and hosed up my shoulder each time). Although I'd like to try BPs again in the future, after reading this article I don't feel nearly as bad as I used to about not being able to BP. For the past year I've been pressing as explained in SS. One shoulder is now completely pain free and the other is slowly but surely getting better. And to think that a little over a year ago a PT told me it was imperative to avoid overhead presses. Go figure!

So far the articles and interviews here have been outstanding. I'm really looking forward to that Tommy Suggs interview.

[Platus]

Anyone happen to spot a video of this lift being performed correctly? Anywhere on youtube maybe? Real interested on seeing how it is really done.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3nJrYPVJ88M
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7erVblY7aiU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u2YmxfQvzP0&feature=related

Nice article. I must admit, that I had not previously realized the difference between the Olympic Press and the style of press in SS. He isn't kidding when he says that it is a fast lift.

[METAL VIPER]

I would very much like to have a higher resolution instruction video demonstrating this type of press; I'd be interested in learning it

[Platus]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vs8svOg9c9o
(Doug Hepburn, but from the angle it is hard to see how much layback he uses)

This website has about 10 videos of various competitors (there's a little pull down menu below the video player - I almost missed it the first time):
http://www.chidlovski.net/liftup/web_external_modules.asp?s_module=mod_press_techni ques

As for higher resolution.... since the lift hasn't been contested on an Olympic stage since 1972, I think we mostly only have very old video reels and 8mm films. I'd love it if someone could make a video of anyone who still trains and performs the lift as Bill describes it.

I also came across this short doc about Alexeev:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ewDX4Cx4mTc

[Platus]

Here's a whole bunch of old Russian videos, many of which include the Olympic Press. There's even some footage of Tommy Kono competing:

http://vimeo.com/7091824

[danielduane]

Starr writes:
In addition, the bench press is frequently overworked and the
joints involved – shoulders, elbows, and wrists – pay the price. Added to this is the fact that few who are enamored with the bench press seldom do anything significant for their upper backs. Eventually, those muscles supporting the shoulder joints in the front become much stronger than those in the rear, and when that happens the athlete begins to experience pain in the rear portion of the shoulders. If they do not respond sensibly to the early warning signals and continue to pound away on the bench press, the pecs will tighten and shorten and at the same time the muscles that support the rotator cuffs become weaker in a process called “reciprocal inhibition.” In short, if any upper body exercise should be dropped from a routine, it’s the bench press, not the press.

My question: what sort of exercises does Starr have in mind, for the upper back, to offset this "reciprocal inhibition"? Couldn't the press alone guard against this problem?

[Mark Rippetoe]

It has been my experience that it does, and that that presses are sufficient to balance out the shoulder. I have used them to correct chronic shoulder problems for many years.

[danielduane]

Thanks, Rip.

[Hugh]

This olympic style press is basically a competition imposed method of getting heavy stuff overhead. The extra help gained by the techniques in this article serve to pop the bar up at the begining. My question is -

is it that important considering it isnt contested and if someone was looking to see how much they could lift with a extra pop would they not just be better off push pressing?

I just fail to see the value aside from learning another technique.

Can somebody enlighten me! preferably with out the use of violence. :)

I know that when I tried it it did require coordination and used more muscle than the strict press but surely the push press and jerk are superior?

[Mark Rippetoe]

I think the article explains the historical context in which this form was developed. Starr used it to press 350 at 198. Can you push press 350?

[OITW]

Okay, I tried it last night at considerably less than 380. It could be I need some coaching in it, but I ended up preferring the "slow lift" version from SS. Hard to rest the bar on the deltoids without shrugging the shoulders forward, resulting in elbows way forward of the bar. Squeezing the elbows back to get a vertical forearm put the bar closer towards my fingers, which had to weaken the drive. Perhaps a wider grip was called for (long arms but forearms are in proportion to upper arms). I could certainly get the "pop" of the bar off the shoulders with that first move, I just couldn't extend the arms enough under it to take advantage of the pop.

Two sets of 3 reps at my PR, went back to the slow version (with a lot more initial lean) and squeezed out 4 reps.

[Hugh]

Ounces mayby pounds no.

I take it I should spend less time thinking and more time lifting then.

Thanks Rip

[SamGriffin]

What sort of rep/set schemes are appropriate for the Olympic-Style Press?

[Mark Rippetoe]

http://startingstrength.com/articles/stronger_press_starr.pdf

[SamGriffin]

Good stuff. Is 5x5 across inappropriate?

[Mark Rippetoe]

I don't think they're inappropriate, but they're not included in Starr's article. He did write an article about the answer to your previous question, right?

[SamGriffin]

I don't think they're inappropriate, but they're not included in Starr's article. He did write an article about the answer to your previous question, right?

I dunno. I haven't been able to find the article.

I kid. I kid. Seriously, I'll try not to make the same mistake again.

Thank you for these articles, this forum, your time, and for answering our dumb questions.